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Thread: tire time again

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,119

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    Experienced the false sense of security that AWD provides years ago, when the XC first came out. Rented one from Hertz in Burlington, VT during a snow storm, and there were a couple of times that the AWD masked the lack of traction in the wet, heavy snow...and I was all over the ABS trying to stop the car.

    At that time, I was living in Colorado and had 4 Conti snow tires on my MB...and that old thing would outperform every SUV with All-seasons when the snow hit. The XC's AWD just masked the lack of traction and provided an utterly false sense of security...sure you can get going...but you don't crash because you can't get going...you crash because you can't stop or turn...

    There is such a huge difference in snow performance between All-seasons (which is a terribly mis-leading label...) and dedicated winter tires, but most people have not experienced it. There is a reason that Germany requires 4 (not 2) dedicated winter tires from Nov 1 to Apr 1...it's the law there...here, we're free to be ignorant, or stupid...

    I know, I know...another rant from Astro...I need another cup of coffee this morning...
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (130K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (58K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (147K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (247K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (300K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (230K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Devon PA
    Posts
    11,409

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    Yes you do, (more coffee)!
    All seasons or snows, doesn't matter
    All a snow tire will do do is give you (much) better traction to get going...not to stop!
    There's not a tire out there that can make you stop any better (well, maybe a studded tire) which is why we all see many SUV accidents, even those with an aggressive tire on

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,119

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    Respectfully, I have to disagree with you on that score...running 4 Nokian Hakapellittas on an old 240 (Wagon, RWD, no ABS), I stopped on an icy downhill in Vermont so that I could help the driver of the Subaru Outback who could not stop on the same hill...there were lots of times that my MB or my 240 was in control while others were sliding to a stop in Vermont and Colorado. The siping and rubber compounds in modern snows make a huge difference on icy, slick roads and in the snow.

    Objective testing:http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=116

    And my lovely bride just brought me a second cup...all is well!
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (130K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (58K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (147K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (247K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (300K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (230K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    New England
    Posts
    676

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    The Mastercraft Strategy are M+S rated, so I think that makes them a snow tire, for what that is worth.

    I found a site online (www.tireteam.com), which has them for $439.42 including shipping, which Town Fair will match.

    Better than the bald Nokians on there now. Of course the tire place is a zoo today, with cars with numbers on them, people yelling, it is like a Chinese fire drill because of the coming Nor' Easter!

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    30

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    Thank you all... I'm going to Sam's club to get some snow tires!

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,119

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    The Mastercraft Strategy are all-seasons...M+S rating is only property of rubber - void ratio in the tread design...lots of SUVs have tires that are M+S rated. The BFG All Terrain TA KOs on my truck are M+S rated, but they are NOT snow tires...

    Worse, the Mastercraft are the wrong speed and load rating. There is more to tires than the size...the speed, load rating and service application all matter...

    Snow tires have the severe service emblem (the mountain with snowflake).

    Go to http://www.tirerack.com/winter/tech/...jsp?techid=125 for an explanation...and the Continental Extreme Winter Contact is reasonably priced and performed the best in the Tire Rack comparison test.

    Don't compromise your great car with cheap tires or tires that aren't suited for it...that's like putting on loafers to run a marathon...sure, they're shoes...but wrong for the application.
    Last edited by Astro14; 10-29-2011 at 07:17 AM.
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (130K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (58K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (147K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (247K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (300K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (230K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    New England
    Posts
    676

    Default

    The BFG AT KO are absolutely one of the BEST snow tires I have ever had, and many, MANY agree with that sentiment.

    I thought the M+S stood for Mud and Snow, which means snow tires.

    No?

    As far as compromise, the transmission is already a crapshoot, so why stress it? I'd rather let the tires slip a little to put less stress on it. ;-)

    This car is overweight and a total pig. It sucks gas more than a pickup, and eats suspension, brakes and tires. The one thing I like about it is that it is pretty quiet and safe, and the engine pulls nicely.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,119

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    Read the article on the link...short answer: NO.

    Long answer - I have BFG AT KOS on the truck and love them...the BFGs are good in snow, but they suck in comparison to the Nokians that I had on my 240 or the Nokians on my XC now. They were/are phenomenal...and there is no comparison on ice...the actual performance is far different and maximizes both safety and control and allows you to use all that the XC has to offer: AWD, ABS, DSTC, etc...

    That opinion is from people who have never driven on real winter tires...because they cost money and aren't required in the US. (which explains all the subies and SUVs I used to see wrecked in the Colorado mountains or in Vermont as I drove by in RWD car with no ABS...).

    In Germany, it is the law that you mount 4 winter tires (severe service, not M+S) for winter...but then, they take driving seriously...as do the Quebecois...for whom it is the law as well...
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (130K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (58K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (147K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (247K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (300K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (230K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    Posts
    463

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    Quote Originally Posted by Astro14
    ...they take driving seriously...as do the Quebecois...
    I wouldn't go that far until you have driven in Quebec, especially Montreal. Turn signals are optional, stop signs are only suggestions, and god help you if you don't have QC plates or are in a federal government car or are a pedestrian.

    Yes, there are good QC drivers and bad ON drivers. But even colleagues from QC agree that their fellow citizens are not the best behind the wheel.


  10. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,119

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    Fair enough...I've been to Montreal many, many times...but my point was more that cabs and rental cars are required by law to have 4 snow tires during winter...almost like the Germans...

    But obeying traffic laws? Oh, mon Dieu!
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (130K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (58K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (147K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (247K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (300K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (230K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

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