2004 Volvo XC70 3rd gear issues

[ottergy]

I just picked up a 2004 XC70 with 170k on it.
It's a really nice car but 3rd gear won't engage . I knew this going into this purchase .

I drove it home from Portland ( about 4 1/2 hours ), and it drove great except for having to use the manual shift to get passed 3rd and then putting it into Drive when coming to a stop.

My thinking was that this problem might be because someone had mistakenly removed the band anchor bolt to refill it with trans fluid and disconnected the band in the process. This seems fairly common from what I’ve read.

I have looked into the repair by drilling and tapping a hole through the anchor bolt and fishing the band anchor into place. This is a fix that I think I could handle.

When I got the air filter off, I noticed that the bolt head was 5 sided and it looked un-molested. It seems that if you tried to remove this without the right tool it would get marked up and so maybe this was'nt the problem.

The only other symptom is that it shifts pretty hard when stopped with the brake on, shifting back and forth between forward and reverse. It does soften up after a few times.
The fluid is brownish and don’t have a good read on the level yet… dipstick broke taking it out.

What I want to know is if there are other issues that would have the same problem of not engaging in just 3rd, with the other gears shifting well?
I just want to know before I pull the bolt out to re-attach the band anchor. ( Because I won’t know at that point if I just released it or it was already released.)

[Astro14]

Not hard to flush (Google Gibbons flush, and follow that, it's a cooler line fluid exchange) and I would start there.

If third is completely gone, then, like you, I suspect someone removed that bolt.

I would remove and reinstall the band anchor. Hoonk had a good post on it in this forum. Swedespeed may have a few more.

If neither of those fix it, it's time for a transmission shop - look for a good local one. Budget about $3,000.

[ottergy]

Yeah, there is nothing there in 3rd. Just revs out like it's missing.
I'm going to drain it and look for "bits" in the fluid. Don't know if it possibly lost the friction material off the band some how.
Have you heard of Seafoam Trans Tune? Any thoughts?
BTW, nice fleet!...I'm new to forums, how do you put that on your post?

[Astro14]

I'm not a fan of solvents in engines or transmissions, and I'm not certain where trans-tune fall in that spectrum. Can't really hurt in your case.

If nothing happens, I really think it's the band anchor - you wouldn't be the first. I remember a few posts in the forums years ago in which third party* service information actually listed that bolt as a fill plug for the transmission (horribly wrong, of course).

If the band anchor is secure (once you're done fishing it into place) then, really, the other possibilities require major transmission surgery.

You have either a completely shot band (no friction left) which requires a rebuild, or you have a bad actuator for that gear, which requires a rebuilt, or you have a dead solenoid for that gear, which requires valve body work. All major stuff.

I'm hoping it's the band anchor.

Regardless, the effort to eliminate the band anchor as a cause is well worth it if it saves you the $3,000 rebuild.

Finally - thanks, the fleet has expanded to include a 2004 V70R (manual). I include it in my signature, under the user settings. I'll update mine now. I'm a bit of a Volvo guy.

Cheers,
Astro


* this is why I trust only VIDA...

[ottergy]

Thanks for your help Astro14, I hope it"s the band too.
What color is your R? I've always wanted a Saffron...Take care

[FirstVolvo]

I just picked up a 2004 XC70 with 170k on it.
It's a really nice car but 3rd gear won't engage . I knew this going into this purchase .

I drove it home from Portland ( about 4 1/2 hours ), and it drove great except for having to use the manual shift to get passed 3rd and then putting it into Drive when coming to a stop.

My thinking was that this problem might be because someone had mistakenly removed the band anchor bolt to refill it with trans fluid and disconnected the band in the process. This seems fairly common from what I’ve read.

I have looked into the repair by drilling and tapping a hole through the anchor bolt and fishing the band anchor into place. This is a fix that I think I could handle.

When I got the air filter off, I noticed that the bolt head was 5 sided and it looked un-molested. It seems that if you tried to remove this without the right tool it would get marked up and so maybe this was'nt the problem.

The only other symptom is that it shifts pretty hard when stopped with the brake on, shifting back and forth between forward and reverse. It does soften up after a few times.
The fluid is brownish and don’t have a good read on the level yet… dipstick broke taking it out.

What I want to know is if there are other issues that would have the same problem of not engaging in just 3rd, with the other gears shifting well?
I just want to know before I pull the bolt out to re-attach the band anchor. ( Because I won’t know at that point if I just released it or it was already released.)


One thing you can do to check if the anchor bolt was removed, without removing it again, is to check the band movement through the servo. You remove the servo cover, leave the servo piston in place and push firmly on the middle pin of the servo piston with the wooden handle of rubber mallet or equivalent and make a mark on the handle with the edge of the case, see pdf. The mark from the end of the handle to outside edge of the case should be approximately 18mm and you'll feel the 3rd gear brand compress as you push on the handle against the servo piston and it will bottom out as the band is compressed fully against the drum. If the anchor bolt was removed I would expect the measurement will be far off the expected 18mm mark.

https://app.box.com/s/tclo8cpy36s8c9dsuykjjmwi0cuzg56s

https://app.box.com/s/9htdu1pp0d6hxk1cr66horfrknq5mmde

https://app.box.com/s/jhcg4uo7kuoev6m1u5xor4rwg8s53q94

[Xfingers]

Regardless of your issue, if you say your ATF is "brown" then like Astro said, do a Gibbons Flush and I would add ASAP. New bright red fluid should improve your trans performance across the board and you're not going to want to have old fluid in there after whatever repair you decide to do to the trans. Astro and FirstVolvo know their sh*t.

[ottergy]

Thanks everyone for all your input.
I don't know why I've waited so long to use these forums to my advantage.

What I plan on doing is flushing the trans 2-3 times with trying the Seafoam Trans Tune on the first flush. Driving it 20-30 miles between each. There was a youtube from a guy that tried this with great results. He did the drain pan method and then added 3.3 quarts of fluid. Using Valvoline Max Life, which apparently meets the JWS-3309 specs. Then do the complete flush method ...Please chime in if you disagree .

Then I will try the band achor fix because it can't hurt and it's pretty easy to access. At that point I will decide how much effort I want to expend to make this car a keeper..transmission wise
I only paid $1300 for the car and it might be better to pass it on to someone with more ambition and younger hands/eyes.

But first I have a new issue. The car died while I was letting it run to warm it up. It seems to be a fuel issue.
There seems to be very little pressure at the fuel rail.
I can here the pump working, but it seems to run an unusually long time to prime. When I released the pressure at the rail it was just a very short soft burst of pressure then a dribble. Had my wife crank it over while I held the valve open and just a intermittent dribble of fuel.
I will change the fuel filter today and maybe get lucky. It looks like the original is on there still (170k) and I think the car had sat for some time.
If it turns out to be the fuel pump, I know there are a couple XC70's at the local pick a part wrecking yard. They are P2 but not sure what year.
Does anyone know what year range fuel pump would fit a 2004 XC?
I have to go this route because I don't want to bone up $400 for a new one until I can determine the trans situation.

Thanks again

[Xfingers]

Are you getting a strong fuel smell inside the pass compartment? People who have had fuel pump issues sometimes report smelling gas. Hoping its a clogged fuel filter.

[ottergy]

No fuel smell in vehicle.
I got the old fuel filter off and tried to blow through it... completely clogged!
There was some very fine black sediment that drained out when I emptied it.

Funny story, I went to the local parts store and picked up a new filter ( Carquest brand ). When I got home,
I thought I'd try blowing through the new one to compare with the old. Could not get air through that thing to save my life!
Took it back to the store and the guy told me it was probably supposed to be that way because it was so "heavy duty"...YIKES!
Told him to pull another one and I blew into it... no resistance at all.
Can you imagine the hair pulling frustration some poor guy would have after putting in that defective filter and still trying to chase down his lack of fuel pressure.

I will get the new filter in today and see where I'm at.
Would like to get the tank emptied, but have'nt figured out an easy way to do that yet.

[ottergy]

Does anybody know if when I turn the ignition on with the fuel filter removed, should gas come out of the line from the tank?
I can here the pump cycle, but no fuel comes out.

[Astro14]

Does anybody know if when I turn the ignition on with the fuel filter removed, should gas come out of the line from the tank?
I can here the pump cycle, but no fuel comes out.

My VIDA is down in my shop - so can't get to it, but I seem to recall that the ECU has to see spark before it supplies fuel, so, I believe the answer to your question, on a properly functioning vehicle is, "No, it won't come out with ignition on".

[ottergy]

Thanks Astro14... I had a feeling that it would be more involved.
One of the reasons I decided to try this forum is that I don't have a great understanding of these modern systems, but I love these cars.
I am not getting any fuel to the fuel rail now. Without a good service manual or system diagram yet, I don't know all the components involved to check.
The car was running fine and just sputtered out and died after idling for about 20 min. Sounded like it ran out of fuel.
I know someone might ask... it shows 1/3 tank, but I am going to try to check manually or add some gas.
I can hear the fuel pump cycle when I turn the key.
Sometimes what sounds like a 2nd louder motor/pump sounds briefly when I turn the key. Sounds like it is coming from up front.
I was thinking it might be a good idea to expose the fuel pump and drivers side sump cover. If for no other reason to check for fuel leakage and hear it better.
Any suggestions for my next move would be greatly appreciated .

[Brett San Diego]

Put in the new filter, add 5 gal of gas, and try starting it. Stop messing around. :)

Brett