Still trying to decide

[gibbons]

1. I used to buy Hondas because they were bullet proof and would last forever.  Are new generation Volvos good, for say, 200,000 miles with normal care?  Our last Honda was 14 years old when it got crashed, or it would probably be 17 years old now.

2. I usually change the oil on a new car a bunch when they are new, like 500 miles, 1500 miles, and then go with 3000 intervals.  Volvo's 7500 seems really long, but there is a bunch of oil (7.2 qts).  Anyone else go shorter intervals?  Is there anything special about the factory fill oil?  As I recall, Ford said they put in special break-in oil that has special additives.  

3. What octane of gas does a 2004 like?  I know my wife will just want to use regular when I am not looking.

4. I have never heard of DTSC (sp?) on a car out here in the west when I have called around looking for a car equipped as I want.  Anyone think it is unnecessary?  Obviously, the general managers ordering don't think much of it.

5. What would you do if you could get $4,700 off the retail price of the one you wanted?  How often does that happen in Volvo land?  It's quite common to see $10,000 off (with incentives) from a $35,000 SUV.

6.  What is the weight capacity of the roof rails?

Thanks for any insights.

[TractorPilot]

Question 1:

Depends on your idea of normal care. I have owned a 1995 850 wagon for the past 5 years, which we drive 25K miles/year. It now has 170K miles, runs perfectly, and has been an extremely satisfying car to own. However, you must be willing to temper your expectations. It’s not a Honda or Toyota. This particular model year Volvo has several systems that wear-out or fail at predictable intervals. It also had a few systems that were known to be unreliable, but have all now been replaced. I believe all modern Volvos, including the XC70, are this way. Once out of warranty, the key has been to find a good independent shop that knows Volvos, and to be diligent with them in pro-active maintenance. With this car, I have spent about $1K every year on such work, but as a result, the car has never stranded us, an actually drives as well or better than any new car I have test driven in that past several years.

Based on my experience and approach to normal care, I have a lot of confidence in Volvo automobiles, and as such recently bought a 2001 XC70. This car already has 70K miles, but is in excellent condition, and has required very little maintenance to date. However, I am already aware of systems on this model that will need to be monitored for wear and replacement. Other than the brakes and tires, this car needs new sway bar linkages now, and I anticipate that other suspension linkages will need replacement in the early 100K’s. Just be prepared, but realize that with care appropriate for a Volvo, you’ll be more likely to trade-up before the car ever comes close to wearing-out.

Question 2:

I can’t speak to initial oil fills, but once the car is broken-in, I don’t believe there is any advantage to taking it to a dealer for an oil change. Personally, I like taking our Volvos to Midas. For $25 they do a thorough oil change and fluid check, plus, they also inspect the brakes, suspension, exhaust, and rotate the tires. To me, this is a really good value.

As to oil change intervals, I designed engines for 10 years before going back to law school, so I have my own opinion. Oil life depends on the number time the fluid has made a trip through the engine. The greater the oil capacity, the fewer trips it will have made through the engine for a given number of miles traveled. In large diesel engines for example, I have seen large oil drums attached to the side of semis for increased engine oil capacity, and as a result see these engines 500K miles or more between oil changes. My advice: save you money and stick with Volvo’s recommended oil change interval. Shorter oil change intervals will probably not be of any benefit to you.

Question 3:

For both our 850 and XC70, we use 89 octane, but that’s because it is cheaper here than 87. With the lower compression ratio of the XC70 (turbo charged) than out 850 (non-turbo), I have had no problem with 87 octane though. So long as the car is not “pinging”, you can just about run the lowest octane number as you want to.

Question 4:

I was under the impression from the Volvo literature for the XC70 that DTSC was integrated with the all wheel drive system. I don’t believe there is an option to choose DTSC for the XC70, but that it comes standard. (does anyone out there disagree?)

Question 5:

Not sure - I’ve never bought new. You might want to see what one-year-old XC70’s are selling for to get an idea of whether your new price is a good deal or not. If you decide you don’t want the XC after a few months, it would be good to know how much you could expect to loose.

Question 6:

The roof rack is good for 220 pounds. Another option: install a trailer hitch receptacle and add a cargo platform which is good for 300 lbs of load capacity. Here's a good link if you're interested: http://www.etrailer.com/


I hope that helps. Good luck with your search.

Scott. http://xc70.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[edg]

RE: DSTC - it's a $700-$800 option on 2004 XC70s.  Very difficult to find an XC with DSTC in dealer inventories in the US.

Ed

[Big]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (gibbons @ Nov. 07 2003,19:23)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Thanks for any insights.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
You&#39;re welcome&#33; &nbsp;http://xc70.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif &nbsp;Most of these things have been discussed if you are handy with the forum&#39;s search feature. But my take:

Longevity - Who knows with today&#39;s cars? The extensive use of computers and plastics make all brands suspect. I&#39;d say new Volvo&#39;s are built to last but some parts will need to be replaced before 200k miles. The 2.5T engine is considered one of the best Volvo has made.

Oil - Follow the manufacturer&#39;s recommendation. For severe use change more frequently.

Gas - Regular (87 octane) works although Premium (91 octane) is recommended. You may get slightly better performance and mileage with Premium. Gas with methanol is forbidden.

DSTC - Dynamic Stability and Traction Control may be one of the least understood options. It is standard on the XC90 but an option on the XC70. Because it is just another hidden safety feature, most dealers assume people don&#39;t want to pay for it. Here&#39;s an explanation of how it works from Volvo (go to the Volvo websites in the U.S. and Sweden for more info):

DSTC enhances active safety in two areas. It helps to prevent the driving wheels spinning when starting, accelerating and driving. In addition, DSTC actively counteracts tendencies to skid.

The DSTC system works via the ABS system. Sensors measure the rotational speed of the four wheels and steering wheel angles, among other things. In addition, there is a gyro, which senses the behavior of the car when it comes to directional stability. The DSTC processor compares the actual behavior of the car with the desired behavior. Every deviation from the norm, such as the slightest indication of a rear-wheel skid, causes the system to intervene and correct the behavior of the car by braking the wheel or wheels which are needed to put the car back on course.

In principle, DSTC can be described as an invisible hand which helps the car stay on course, even in very difficult road conditions. DSTC does not correct skids. The system is designed to ensure that they never occur in the first place. If a skid is unavoidable, DSTC helps to make it less dramatic and prevents the car skidding across the road at right angles. DSTC is especially valuable when the driver has to brake hard in connection with sudden evasive action. In such cases, the system helps the driver to retain control of the car and still avoid the obstacle.

Price - If you are willing to take what&#39;s on the lot, many dealers should be willing to deal. As mentioned, overseas delivery is an attractive option. Check out that section of this forum for user experiences.

Roof rails - Plenty strong for anything you should carry.

Have fun shopping&#33;

[gibbons]

Thanks everyone for the help. &nbsp;

First, the roof capacity. &nbsp;Here is a picture of the Subaru my kids drive, but we use it occasionally for family stuff.
http://chevelles.com/showroom/gibbons/subaru.JPG
Those are Specialized FSRs (five of &#39;em), with Yakima racks on Subaru roof rails. &nbsp;That&#39;s about 160 lbs load weight. &nbsp;But when you corner, you get lateral acceleration loads, and significant wind drag loads. &nbsp;The roof used to &quot;oil can&quot; where the Subaru rails met the roof, so I pulled out the headliner and installed large steel plates laminated in with epoxy putty. &nbsp;Fixed that problem&#33; &nbsp;I was concerned about the XC because it doesn&#39;t look easy to do with that car. &nbsp;Yeah, sometimes, we should just take them in our truck, but a SuperCab truck is a little uncomfortable for 250 mile trips. &nbsp;BTW, at 5000&#39; elevation, top speed on the Sube is 75 mph floored with bikes on and all our stuff inside &nbsp;

Second, DTSC. &nbsp;I can&#39;t see why someone wouldn&#39;t order it. &nbsp;Spend &#036;40K for a safe car, and then leave off a pretty cool option to help even more? &nbsp;Doesn&#39;t make sense to me, but I&#39;m just an engineer. &nbsp;If the cars already come with individual channel ABS and EBS, is DTSC just a software thing? &nbsp;The dealer says if a customer can&#39;t see it, they don&#39;t want to pay for it. &nbsp;

Third, long term reliability- I ready about all the problems XCs have, and it makes me nervous. &nbsp;But then again, most people just post about stuff that gives them problems, just like they do at the Subaru site.

Still don&#39;t know which way we&#39;re going to go here. As I mentioned in another post, the dealer jacked his price up &#036;1000 over a weekend and won&#39;t negotiate. &nbsp;I will pass on the car before I would cave in to them, even if I did want to buy it. &nbsp;The salesman is Chris. &nbsp;Hey Chris, if you are lurking on this board, I am dead serious, you lost a sale.

[Outrageous]

Subaru will have a new Legacy/Outback coming out fairly soon. &nbsp;It&#39;s already been out in Japan for a while and should be appearing in Europe about now. &nbsp;Just in case you wanted to wait.

[Big]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (gibbons @ Nov. 09 2003,13:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Those are Specialized FSRs (five of &#39;em), with Yakima racks on Subaru roof rails. That&#39;s about 160 lbs load weight.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I&#39;ve seen the maximum roof load for the XC70 listed as 100 kg (220 lb).

[NeuDaddi]

On a 2004 XC70 with the usual trimmings, the difference between MSRP and invoice price is around &#036;3000. &nbsp;Add the current incentives, and the difference drops to &#036;5000. &nbsp;&#036;4700 off the sticker price might be a good deal, but it probably won&#39;t be as good as OSD, although you would have to then wait for the car.