Audi Allroad vs Volvo xc70?

[John Hagerty]

I am not trying to make anyone upset here, I am new to the site, I have owned 3 audis, now considering the xc70, so really looking for comparison.

One reason I started looking to the volvo is the turbo 5, I had the audi turbo 5 20valve in original audi, this is arguably one of the great motors, of course no longer available.

I do not see much on the longevity of the volvo motor, etc. Just curious?

And yes I do already have an allroad, like the car very well, but also know its weaknesses.

Thanks, John

[billr99]

I am not trying to make anyone upset here, I am new to the site, I have owned 3 audis, now considering the xc70, so really looking for comparison.

One reason I started looking to the volvo is the turbo 5, I had the audi turbo 5 20valve in original audi, this is arguably one of the great motors, of course no longer available.

I do not see much on the longevity of the volvo motor, etc. Just curious?

And yes I do already have an allroad, like the car very well, but also know its weaknesses.

Thanks, John

John:

I too have had Audis as well as a bunch of Volvos and I would say overall that they are similar in many respects when it comes to reliability and longevity. I've had examples of both marques that I've put huge miles on and I've had niggling problems with both. I've also had a couple not so great cars in both marques (an Audi Fox and a Volvo 265 come to mind) .

From an AWD standpoint, I like Audi's system better but that comment goes back to the original Quattro and Torsen-based systems. I'm not keen on the Haldex systems of either company so perhaps someone who has lived with these can comment.

Motor-wise, I don't see much difference in terms of maintenance or overall reliability. Both are stout. Again, the old cast-iron block motors of both companies were amazing in terms of lasting nearly forever, but the alloy blocks motors do pretty decent as well. I've had these motors last into the 2-300K mile ranges with not much work beyond too-the-book maintenance. Nothing more, but nothing less. To be fair, I have blown a head in an old Audi 5 (at 310K miles though) and the same thing in a red block Volvo motor at 260K mile. Interestingly, I gave the Audi to my brother who rebuilt the head and drove the car another 50K before selling it to someone for use as a rally car. The Volvo was scrapped since it already had a bashed in drivers rear and a not-great interior.

Now as far as the niggling electronic problems, I don't have any real experience with the newer Audis; but I since I cruise those forums as well, it looks like Audi have similar problem to the newer Volvos. I would further suspect, using Toyota as an example, that many marques have electronic issues theses days. As they have continued to improve the actual operation of the mechanical bits, many times thru electronics, the problems have moved away from the more traditional mechanical areas to electronics and electrical systems. Here my opinion would be that it is how the OEM and their dealer networks respond to the problems. I can tell you that Volvo does not appear to me to be all that great. I suppose my biggest gripe is that their is no way for a Volvo owner to deal with these except having to go to the dealer for a VIDA/VADIS hook-up. At least with Audi you can do somethings with a VagCom. Of course, if you are at the dealers mercy, it comes out equal.

Finally, if you would ask me which I actually prefer overall I would have to say I like the sportiness of an Audi over a Volvo (even if I recall my R); but if I have to go haul lumber or something, the Volvo is much more utilitarian in my view. Can't say I'd replace my XC with an Avant, but I wouldn't mind adding an S4 to the my stable.

Cheers,

Bill

[BIGGUYNE]

I had a 1974 Audi 100LS. Loved to drive the car-- hated all the mechanical issues with it. We stayed away from Audi's until my wife's 1991 A6 2.7T. An absolutely outstanding car that we still have. It's been virtually bulletproof, as have been the 3 XC70's I've had since 1990. If Audi had had as good of an OSD program as Volvo then at least one of those XC70's would have been an Allroad...but alas! Now that the Allroad is no more, I don't have to consider that potential.

While the cars have many similarities, I've found the Audi's to be "trendier." More modern, sleeker interiors, areo-shaped, etc. Maybe I'm just older, but when it's time to replaced our A6, we'll do an S80 this time.

[John Hagerty]

That is some good info, and I think I have to agree mostly.

A 91 2.7t, do you mean an '01? I have that motor of course in the allroad.

My wife is wanting a newer car, she has the 2.8 in an A6, that is what I am thinking of replacing with the xc70, she wants another allroad.

We tend to keep our cars, and I am a little concerned on the high miles on the allroad, probably being too high tech, with lots of potential very expensive repairs, ie twin turbo, air suspension.

What is the mileage for replacement of timing belt on the xc70 motor and what is the appx cost of replacing it?

[Allen]

I love Audi's, but I can't afford one. Plus the XC70 has gobs more cargo area.

[John Hagerty]

Hi Allen,

We always buy used, suprisingly it seems the allroad has a taller cargo area than the xc70 and it actually has more leg room in the rear seat area, I think the length of cargo area may be a bit longer.

How many miles on your xc70?

I am curious about people who have driven them to high mileage and how many major fixes?

I saw the posts on the tranny's, I will definately know to watch out for that, I am going to pre ask my prefered mechanic if he knows about this:) That was Super helpfull (Where not to fill the atf)

[Allen]

Hi Allen,

We always buy used, suprisingly it seems the allroad has a taller cargo area than the xc70 and it actually has more leg room in the rear seat area, I think the length of cargo area may be a bit longer.

How many miles on your xc70?

I am curious about people who have driven them to high mileage and how many major fixes?

I saw the posts on the tranny's, I will definately know to watch out for that, I am going to pre ask my prefered mechanic if he knows about this:) That was Super helpfull (Where not to fill the atf)

I've got 86k on mine, bought it @ 50k three years ago. I've made several 2000 mile round trips without a hitch.

It got me through the worst snow storm I've ever had to drive through, and saved my ass at least three different times during that trip. I had no idea the XC70 was unstoppable until that journey.

Mine's not required any major repairs at all.

I had to replace both tail light assemblies because they started blowing brake light bulbs. Probably just some corrosion. $120 each from www.autopartswarehouse.com.

Had a clamp degrade on the power steering reservoir hose. Cost me $0.90.

Today I changed out both foglight assemblies. The glass was broken on the driver side, bulb retainer was broken on the passenger side. Paid $120 for both from Auto Lights & Bulbs, http://www.amazon.com/gp/browse.html?ie=UTF8&marketplaceID=ATVPDKIKX0DER&me=A2H0640FKBNN92 on Amazon.com. Independent shop gave me a price of $160 each plus labor, so I did it myself. Not hard at all.

It's running like a champ, and I couldn't ask for a more reliable car.

The left rear door speaker blew a few days ago, and I've been pulling my hair out trying to find a replacement, but today it's working fine. *scratches head*

The only headaches I've had with the car were when I first bought it from a dealer, and had them take care of some battery issues for me. I got raped.

I've found an independent repair shop and they treat me like an old friend. It's great.

I'd love to have another Audi along side this Volvo, but I ain't got the cash these days.

[cool2]

[BIGGUYNE]

You're right-- 2001 A6 2.7T.
I've run my Xc70's to 220,000 miles (2000), 140,000 (2004) and current 2007 has 98,000 on it. Really pleased with how they've held up.

Only complaint is the rear seat legroom-- much worse than the A6, but hey...I don't sit back there!

[Allen]

Yep, back seat is for kids. :D

[RockitShip]

I seriously considered the Allroad before purchasing my 03 XC70.
I have a 1999 A4 quattro wagon and it handles amazingly, better than the XC in many respects. However, that thing has been a thorn in my side with it's suspension parts always needing upgrading & fixing.

Anyway,
1. The Allroads I looked at (online) were all overpriced, while the XC's were all underpriced (undervalued?). A difference of thousands of dollars. I practically purchased my XC for about half the price of a similar year, mileage, etc. Allroad.

2. The XC has one turbo, one set of oxygen sensors, and a very basic & easy to work on suspension. The Allroad has a much more advanced suspension and thus, much harder and more expensive to work on. It also has airbags that can and do go bad. The all road also has a much more advanced engine, with more HP & torque but it comes at a price of twice as many turbos and sensors, and exhaust parts, etc. that can and do go bad from time to time.

XC70 easier and cheaper to work on, however it's just as refined as an Allroad. And the seats and interior is just as good as Audi if not better albeit the rear seats are probably roomier in the Allroad.

Allroad has more power and doodads and suspension/handling may be marginally better in some situations, but for a much higher price tag that I can't justify (at the moment).

[Allen]

Audi's are more aggressive. I love aggression. But I can't afford it.

[John Hagerty]

Interesting, and yes, to the point on the audi front suspensions, we have the '98 A6 wagon(the one that may get replaced with the xc70) and the Allroad, both have given us grief with the suspension components, to the tune of $, especially since the allroad has "special" pieces, different from the A6 platform that it comes from.

So it sounds like the volvo suspension is longer lived?

I also still question the mileage when to replace timing belt on the xc70 and the cost?

The allroad cost is $1000-$1500 to do the timing belt at the shop, with all new water pump, tensioners, etc.

I do love the allroad overall, ride, performance, etc, is good.

[Allen]

Interesting, and yes, to the point on the audi front suspensions, we have the '98 A6 wagon(the one that may get replaced with the xc70) and the Allroad, both have given us grief with the suspension components, to the tune of $, especially since the allroad has "special" pieces, different from the A6 platform that it comes from.

So it sounds like the volvo suspension is longer lived?

I also still question the mileage when to replace timing belt on the xc70 and the cost?

The allroad cost is $1000-$1500 to do the timing belt at the shop, with all new water pump, tensioners, etc.

I do love the allroad overall, ride, performance, etc, is good.


This is kind of what I meant when I said I couldn't afford an Audi. I can't afford to buy one, and I certainly can't afford to maintain one. I sure love 'em, though.

XC70's timing belt, if I'm not mistaken, is supposed to be changed out at 105k miles.

[budrichard]

Can't get a new Allroad in the USA.-Dick

[John Hagerty]

How many miles on the '99? When did you change the timing belt, is the '03 a much better car than the '99? Same motor right?

Do any of the xc70's offer a manual trans.?

[Forkster]

John, the Audi and the Volvo are two different animals compared to one another. While both have European heritages, their function and purpose plus driving style is like comparing a Toyota 4Runner to a Subaru Outback.

Volvo Pluses
- cheaper insurance
- cheaper to repair
- easier to turn your own wrenches on (most repairs are DIY)
- a whole lot more safety engineering
- more utilitarian for families
- similar AWD system to Audi

Audi Pluses
- better AWD engineering
- better handling
- interior has better fit and finish
- better styling

I used a list of features I was looking for in the cars my wife and I looked at several years ago when we were car shopping. We then used a weight against the feature depending on how important they were to us. We then scored each feature (0-10) and then multiplied it against the weight. We then totaled up the score and then each car had a rating.

You will also notice a 'blink' score. I'm a believer that once you sit in a car, prior to driving it, you get an initial impression within the first few seconds - the 'blink' effect. It's something worth noticing when you sit in each vehicle. :)

Finally - I put in Dealership. Are they chumps or dinks or do they actually care that you are happy with your purchase? Liking your dealership is important if you're going to buy from a dealer. If not, then you can remove it.

Volvo XC70
Item \ Weight \ Score
Dealership \ 1.0 \ 2 = 2 (Dealership - are the ok? is car dealer dependent?)
Driver Visibility \ .9 \ 9 = 8.1
Fit and Finish \ .5 \ 9 = 4.5
Fuel Econ \ .3 \ 5 = 1.5
Initial Feel \ 1.0 \ 10 = 10 (the 'blink' effect)
Passenger Leg Room \ .5 \ 3 = 1.5
Rear-end Space \ .75 \ 10 = 7.5
Reliability \ .9 \ 7 = 6.3
Safety Features\ 1.0 \ 10 = 10
Towing \ 1.0 \ 10 = 10.0 (I had a trailer, towing was paramount)
Total = 61.4

Audi A4 Avant Quattro
Dealership \ 1.0 \ 8 = 8
Driver Visibility \ .9 \ 7 = 6.3
Fit and Finish \ .5 \ 9 = 4.5
Fuel Econ \ .3 \ 6 = 1.8
Initial Feel \ 1.0 \ 10 = 10
Passenger Leg Room \ .5 \ 7 = 3.5
Rear-end Space \ .75 \ 6 = 4.5
Reliability \ .9 \ 5 = 4.5
Safety Features\ 1.0 \ 7 = 7
Towing \ 1.0 \ 7 = 7
Total = 57.1

And as always, weight and score is completely subjective. That's why when you're paralyzed by two very good cars, you can objectively score each car.

John, now, forget this entire list I just made. Go sit in the two cars you're considering. Sit in the Audi, and then sit in the Volvo - which one that you sat in, within the first 3 seconds, did you go WOW?

[uscgc70]

Wow forkster, my wife would lose interest way to fast if we shopped that way! very thorough though.

[Forkster]

Actually, the whole process took just a 10 minute conversation. We both talked about what features we wanted and important. And then HOW important. She wanted more emphasis on rear cargo room, and my biggest concern was safety. We then came up with the weighted score, and printed off a few sheets. If a car scored 0 we eliminated and if it didn't have stability control, or no side curtain airbags or no towing. We went from 21 vehicles down to 3.

You'd be surprised how many new/newer SUV's and cross-overs don't have passenger air curtains or stability control and how many can't tow more than 1000lbs. Blink factor was wife's choice. The moment we sat in a XC70, we immediately both said 'Y E S'. (personally, I think she liked the fact she had her own climate temperature control). :D

[Canuck]

I take issue with a couple of "facts" being thrown around this thread. As someone who actually owns both a Volvo and an Audi, I can say hands down that the Audi is:
1) Cheaper to insure by exactly $123 per year.
2) Way way way way more reliable.
3) Cheaper to keep on the road by a long shot. The engineering in the Audi is so much better than the Volvo that the repairs are very infrequent and when comparing the exact same job on each car, the Audi bill is within 5% of the Volvo.

Also, I don't believe the fit and finish in the Volvo is anywhere near as nice as the Audi. That's not a slight against the Volvo, it's just that Audi has the nicest interiors out there.

As for the dealer quality, and I realize this varies depending on your location, the Audi dealer where I'm located is head and shoulders above the Volvo in terms of customer satisfaction. Getting anything covered under Volvo's warranty was like pulling teeth - on many occasions I actually had to take a cab to the dealership and argue with the warranty adjuster myself because the service techs were too lazy to do it. Audi's warranty service is amazing.

If you consider the 'fun to drive' factor, the Audi absolutely slaughters the Volvo. Drive an all-road for ten minutes and then get back into an xc70. It's like going from a formula one car to a tractor.

Just my two cents.

[Allen]

I was looking at the Audi Q7's today. All I can say is "Wow!!".

Absolutely glorious vehicle. Especially the "S Line" with the polished metal interior instead of wood grain. There's a buttload of 2007's for sale on eBay right now, post lease, I'd say.

http://images02.olx.org.uk/ui/1/75/97/1796897_1.jpg

[goldxc70]

I was looking at the Audi Q7's today. All I can say is "Wow!!".
Now that is a coincidence!
Different vehicle but I saw an ad for the Audi A3 TDi today and thought to myself that is what I'll go for when I replace my XC70 - unless Volvo bring their diesel models to Canada.

Audi used to be known as the poor man's Mercedes and they continue to work hard to get over that comparison.

In my opinion, the Audi fit and finish is second to none (other than some of the out of reach exotics, of course).