A Very Costly AWD Repair and Disappointing Car

[tapaugh]

I discovered last month that the AWD was not working on my 2003 XC70 with 89,000 miles. My dealer had to open up my transmission and AWD unit to confirm this because my car did NOT show any trouble codes when hooked up to Volvo's computer analyzer. Apparently the trans and AWD unit each have a splined shaft thats spins. When the car's computer detects front wheels losing traction it locks the two splined shafts by sliding a collar over them which engages the AWD and powers the rear wheels. It seems the splines on my AWD unit were stripped clean off. They had to install a new AWD unit and collar at a cost of $2800.00! I asked why this happened and the dealer had no idea. So, based on that, I think that means I may have to replace this unit again sometime in the future. The tech who worked on my car said I was lucky because he had seen cars with the same problem where the sliding collar had gotten stuck inside the transmission requiring it to be replaced too.

Here's the kicker, I just made my last car payment about 2 weeks ago. All in all, this has been the most expensive to maintain car I have ever owned. Most of the front end suspension parts had to be replaced at around 60K miles. That cost another $1400.00. I bought this car because of all of the stories I had heard about Volvo cars and longevity. Stories of cars with 300,000 miles and more. I now see how you accomplish that. You just empty your wallet and fix everything as it breaks and you will make to 300,000 miles. It makes me think that I should have kept my old 1974 Ford Pinto. That car surely would have made it to a million miles if I had just had the good sense to keep repairing it.

[Ragman]

yuk! I thought trannies got better in 2003. Isn't that the year the Haldex was put in them? Sorry to hear of your troubles.

[tapaugh]

Im not sure, but I think you may be right about Haldex. I think Ford Motor Corporation took more from Volvo than it gave back and this is the ugly result.

[Ragman]

I wonder why they didn't benchmark off of Subaru's transmission. Those things are unstoppable.

I agree about Ford. Remember, they're the geniuses who tried to put the horn in the turn signal in the eighties.

[bwik]

My condolences!

The XC70 is one of the most expensive to maintain cars in the world. There is almost total agreement on this point from all sources. My mom likes hers, but yes... it costs a pretty penny to repair.

From my experience, if you want trouble-free motoring, go BMW or Mazda or Subaru or Jeep or...

Even with Audi, at least you know their AWD system is up to snuff.

Truly, I am very sorry to hear about your AWD. Volvo simply did not know how to build an AWD car. Ours is still working at 120k mi. But, that is much luckier than average.

[philosophicaldreamer]

Ours is still working at 120k mi. But, that is much luckier than average.

What is the average?:confused: Do you know?

Ta-ta, j.

[JRL]

Im not sure, but I think you may be right about Haldex. I think Ford Motor Corporation took more from Volvo than it gave back and this is the ugly result.

C'mon, gimme a break.
Ford has nothing to do with the current V70.
Haldex units break although seldom on XC's (vs. the high hp. and high torque R) and so can the angle gear break but again, not very often on XC's with the smaller lesser torque engines.
Sorry to hear but this is why EVERYONE should have an extended warranty on a Volvo.
9BTW, the 300,000 mile, low maintanance Volvo went by the wayside with the 240 in 1993.
From the 1993 850 and newer they are very high maintenance vehicles

[dlr97]

"Apparently the trans and AWD unit each have a splined shaft thats spins. When the car's computer detects front wheels losing traction it locks the two splined shafts by sliding a collar over them which engages the AWD and powers the rear wheels."

This is NOT how the system works. The connection is by wet multi-plate clutch in the Haldex unit. See http://www.haldex-traction.com/default.htm
for details.

Audi/VW also use Haldex for their transverse-engine models (A3 and TT for instance). From the limited info that I have seen, Haldex units have not had high failure rates.

[BillAileo]

With the cost you state ($2,800.00) and the fact that your issue was lack of AWD and replacement of a component with splines, I wonder if what the dealer did was a replacement of the Bevel gear and they simply aren't doing a good job of explaining their work to you....

Bill

[tapaugh]

You may be right, I'm just explaining it exactly the way the dealer explained it to me. To me though, it doesn't matter what broke or how it broke or how the AWD operates. I had to pay for what I consider to be an unusual repair. Since the dealer could not explain the reason this happened I must assume the symptom was treated and the cause of the problem was NOT corrected. Therefore, in my thinking, this problem has a good chance of reoccurring.

In the mean while, my wife's Honda CRV and daughter's Subaru Impreza just keep going and going, completely trouble free. I'm so glad I bought a superior automobile.

[Jorge-789995]

Sorry to hear about your repair. I can feel your pain to a certain extent. I just replaced all brake components, but at least that was a wear item.

All the VC AWD bigots just took one on the chin; unfortunately, you took one in the wallet at the same time. I thought the haldex was infallible.

[Forkster]

You could of course, take other actions including legal but it's your money and time. Cars do break down time to time though.

[tapaugh]

Forkster thank you for the suggestion. Frankly, it's not one that occurred to me but in view of the situation, I think I'll give it a go. What have I got to lose? If Volvo would respond in a favorable way it would at least restore my faith in the company. However, nothing will change the way I feel about their products. Wish me luck.

[SVX JAZZ]

You all should go to www.subaru-svx.net and check out all the AWD failures. Mine went out on my Subaru at 84k. :( 10 years later after the re-build it's running strong though...

[JAGMAN]

I just had a similar failure on my '04V70R. The transmission and angle/bevel gear are bolted together. Both have a splined shaft output. A splined collar is what couples the shafts. When the collar strips out, no more AWD. The splines of the shaft can also be damaged during a failure like this.

As for the Tranny replacement (that your dealer mentioned), this happens when the dealer is unable to remove the damaged collar from the transmission output shaft and has to replace the tranny. The reason they have trouble removing the collar is because they use an inadequate tool (which I won't get into).

Here is a picture of the collar. You can see the splines are stripped out on one side (the bevel gear side), but the other side is fine (tranny side). I replaced the collar and now all is well. Total cost wqs $85 for the collar, and $100 for new oil seals in the tranny and bevel gear (since I was already there).

As I said, I was fortunate that the collar was the only part that was damaged, and the shafts of the tranny and bevel gear were undamaged. I was also fortunate that I can do this work myself. I can almost 100% guarantee that the dealer would've had to replace my tranny, since their tool wouldn't have been strong enough to remove the collar.

I had to drill two holes in the collar and attach a 5-ton puller, then heat the area with Mapp gas.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l64/JAGMAN06/IMG_0045.jpg

[staffann]

It does indeed sound like it was the splines between the tranny and the bevel gear was what was broken. Just want to point out that this has nothing to do with the Haldex unit at all.

I've had to do exactly what JAGMAN decribes on one car, and I can guarantee that getting that collar off can be hard work! There was a lot of rust that made it stick to the tranny very hard. As JAGMAN we had to drill a hole in the collar. We didn't have any 5-ton puller so we had to pull, use sledgehammer etc for quite a while before we managed to get the collar off. We almost gave up before that!

[littlewaywelt]

Cars don't last forever. Things break. Unusual or not.

Our 01 XC was a total money pit from day 1.
Our 05 has been nearly perfect from day 1.

Volvos may not be Hondas, but Hondas are not Volvos either. Honda and Subaru have their share of problems, too. My mother-in-law's suby has had more than its share of problems. My brother's has been outstanding.

[tapaugh]

It's true, nothing last forever and cars do break. I just didn't expect a premium car such as a Volvo to break at 89K miles and considering how well maintained this car was, I feel there's no reason for this other than poor design.

Anyway, I made my last payment on this car about two weeks ago and just today in the mail I received the title for it. So now I own this Swedish marvel of modern technology but thankfully, not for too much longer. I'm gonna let someone else deal with the headaches. This is the second time a European car has bitten me in the ass and wallet. I think I'll take my chances with a Japanese car.

Goodbye to all you good people and thank you for your helpful suggestions.

[Forkster]

Cars don't last forever. Things break. Unusual or not.

Our 01 XC was a total money pit from day 1.
Our 05 has been nearly perfect from day 1.

Volvos may not be Hondas, but Hondas are not Volvos either. Honda and Subaru have their share of problems, too. My mother-in-law's suby has had more than its share of problems. My brother's has been outstanding.I disagree. Considering how long Volvo has been making cars, you would expect them to make a reliable and durable vehicle. Why can I purchase a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry, drive the snot out of it for 250'000 miles and not have to put a dime into it for unexpected maintenance?

Why can't I expect the same reliablilty from my Volvo? Because Volvo is thinking like Ford - frack the customers, lets make a car with cheaper parts that may fail prematurely so we can maximise profits. That is very short sighted thinking, and is why the big three are pretty much bankrupt - customers are getting tired of crappy cars.

Honda and Toyota have a socialist approach to car owners - build a great car, then support the community around it. Heck, when I had my Honda, performance parts were so readily available, it was cheaper to put slotted rotors and crematic pads than the originals - the dealer sold both. The dealer also had a tuning shop, had summer BBQ's to showcase new performance parts, gave away free stuff, support the local city Honda clubs, and gave away tonnes of artwork and logos for fan websites on CD's. If anyone had problems with their car, they were dealt with accordingly so that both partys had a solution the could live with. That is my experience as a Honda owner in Calgary Canada. I can't say the same about Nissan - they're worse than Dodge for reliability (at least my last 99 Maxima was an aweful car to own). I had issues, complained, they said sooo sooorrry. I said, I'll never buy another Nissan and will tell all my friends about your crappy cars. That has cost them $30'000 to date because I didn't buy a Nissan - I purchased a Volvo instead. It seems that Tapaugh has done the same as well - get rid of a bad car.

I could be wrong but people are becoming leary of buying a Volvo - and if that continues, we could loose our favorite car company.

[littlewaywelt]

Volvo's problems have nothing to do with Ford. The big three's financial problems have nothing to do with reliability or irritating their customers. As far as I understand Volvo's part sourcing didn't really change when Ford bought the company. It was the economy pure and simple that hit the big three and their inability to aggressively deal with it in a timely fashion. Volvos have never been as reliable as Hondas and they never will be. You can't assume that every company can do something as well as one company. That's why we always have leaders and followers in various categories.

[Aviator]

The big three's financial problems have nothing to do with reliability or irritating their customers.

They most certainly do !!! Why do you think the "big 3" have partnered up with the likes of Suzuki, Toyota, Nissan, Mitsubishi, etc..? It's because they can't produce a vehicle all on their own that can even come close to Asian quality, reliability, durability. Peoples' eyes have been opening steadily over the years to the satisfaction gained from owning an Asian car. Like they say.....if you can't beat 'em, join 'em !! Crap like Ford Tempos, Escorts, Neons, K Cars, Cavaliers.....all the big 3 junk, is what makes people buy Toyotas, Hondas, etc.

Dave.

[John@CdnRockies]

Interesting comments wrt car quality. This posting thread includes lauditory comments on several sets of wheels that we owned.
(a) Our '96 Jeep was an absolute disaster with multiple drive repairs and ultimately a full replacement. That said, Chrysler was very supportive and I still drive the rig and will buy another one.
(b) The Subaru was a pit stop of money and we dumped it after 2 years as quality was woefully absent. Never again in my case.
(c) Our Honda Accord had a C$2,500 electrical repair directly caused by dealer negligence (not covered by them). Faye has refused to consider another Honda product ever since (this was 15 years ago when $2,500 was a major chunk of money).
(d) Our Maxima also had a number of expensive problems but it is a joy to drive and the local dealer is great.
(e) Our Toyota Avalon had a serious transmission problem in the first 15,000 kilometers. Toyota has finally issued a fix a year later (same problem apparently existed since '05 per internet boards) - otherwise we would have dumped it at lease expiry.

The Volvo has 110,000 kilometers, regularly tows up to its maximum capacity and is our preferred ski vehicle in the Rockies where snow/ice test the Haldex constantly. No major expenditures yet and we would certainly buy another one.

All this to say that, despite their best efforts, manufacturing quality is variable. Some years are fine, others a disaster. Some folks with personal experience will understandably never buy again (try reading the ongoing posts in Edmunds regarding the Toyota Avalon transmission problems "Toyota Avalon +'05"). We refer to Consumer Reports as our bible for independent evaluations and work with that. That last time I looked Volvo XC-70's were still on the recommended list and it is certainly still on ours.

John

[papaquebec]

It is all so subjective. I have always preferred European cars, and have only had a few Japanese cars along the way, but have never owned an American car, nor have I ever wanted one.
On the other hand, since I was young, my mother has owned nothing but Toyota's, and swears by them. She does virtually no maintenance, and drives them until they die, which is a remarkably long time! She is always shocked when she hears how much I have spent on a car, or how much a repair cost.
In general, I have been very, very lucky. The XC is our seventh Volvo, with many more in the family. Of the many cars I have owned, the Audis were the most expensive to maintain in my opinion, and the Land Rovers the least expensive (in my case), along with the one Mercedes I have owned.
Right now I have a '99 Honda Odyssey that we use for our business, with a blown transmission. I took it into the dealer where we bought it a year ago, and apparently it is the third transmission in 100k miles, AND they told me that was common!
I have nothing against Japanese cars, and buy them occasionally, but I have never enjoyed them, they do not seem to have 'soul', I am always disappointed.
Again, it is all subjective.

Patrick

[Forkster]

I agree Patrick that Japanese cars have no 'soul' - about as exciting to drive and look at as watching paint dry.

Questions for all -
1. Could the dealer impact our perception of our cars that we own?
2. What impact will the Company as a whole have?
3. For those who purchased their vehicles used, how are their views different? Are they holistic compared to new cars purchased (unbiased and based solely on the performance/reliability of the vehicle).
4. What impact does the previous owner have on reliability of a used car?

[tkirwan]

Let me just say that Honda owners are not immune to issues. I owned a '90 civic that had brake rotors that were so thin that they were warping every 3000 miles, and had to be replaced each time. Honda wouldn't accept this as a design flaw. I swore that I wouldn't buy another Honda.

However... my wife wanted a Pilot, so I thought that they probably only had that one issue, and that the Pilot would be fine. We got it and within 2000 miles, had to replace the condenser for the A/C. It turns out that several Honda models, including the Pilot and the Odyssey have a wide open area in the lower part of the bumper for air flow. The problem is that it's too wide open, and road debris can get in easily and damage the condenser. Google Honda Condenser and you'll get quite a few hits on it. Some people have had to replace the condenser twice as a result. Since I had so few miles, I was able to get Honda corporate to pay for the part, after asking to talk to the supervisor of the weenie that I first had on the phone. I was then able to get the dealer to pay for the labor. The dealer said that they knew about the problem in the design, but corporate denied that there was an issue. They compared it to road debris hitting the sunroof. Right.

I went right out to ebay and got a billet grille to fill up that space, and I'm now more comfortable when driving on the highway.

Anyway, the Japanese manufacturers also have problems.

[Castle]

The dealer has a lot to do with the ownership experience and the quality of the car. Really.

Good dealerships have good mechanics who do things right.
Good dealerships have good service managers who do the right thing for the customer.

I switched to Volvo after twenty years of driving that other Swedish car because the remaining S**B dealer in my area was absolutely hideous and did more harm to the car (and the brand) than good. My Volvo dealer have bent over backwards to be helpful - to the point where I've now bought multiple Volvos from them and recommend them to other folks.

Even if the vehicle has problems (my XC90 had the wheel bearing failure) they become not such a big deal if handled properly by the dealer.

I've owned MGs and Alfa Romeos, but the second worst car I ever owned from a reliablity standpoint was Japanese; the worst was a VW. The most boring car I ever owned was a Honda. The most expensive to service was the Alfa, followed by a BMW and the Saabs. In comparison, the Volvos are downright frugal.

[tapaugh]

I agree the dealer can make a difference and can enhance your ownership experience. My dealer found the problem, correctly fixed it and offered me coffee and donuts through the whole thing. Very nice! However, it still was a $2800.00 repair job. In my case, that was like adding 8 car payments to my loan. Frugal? I must respectfully disagree.

[PierreC]

My experience is that Volvo - which is part of Ford's Premier Automotive Group or PAG - does not have corresponding PAS or Premier Automotive Service ... more like PFS or Plain Ford Service. What I am saying is that I have detected a regression in quality of service from Volvo dealerships since Ford took control - at least in South Africa. And I have 3 Volvos - '96 850GLT which still is the cheapest to run car I had ever owned, a '2002 V70XT and a 2004 S60 2.0T (which I believe is a model not sold in North America). Oh, for the record, I got my first car in '72 - a Toyota, an experience that cured me from Japanese cars in general and Toyota specifically for a lifetime!

[philosophicaldreamer]

My experience is that Volvo - which is part of Ford's Premier Automotive Group or PAG - does not have corresponding PAS or Premier Automotive Service ... more like PFS or Plain Ford Service. What I am saying is that I have detected a regression in quality of service from Volvo dealerships since Ford took control - at least in South Africa. And I have 3 Volvos - '96 850GLT which still is the cheapest to run car I had ever owned, a '2002 V70XT and a 2004 S60 2.0T (which I believe is a model not sold in North America). Oh, for the record, I got my first car in '72 - a Toyota, an experience that cured me from Japanese cars in general and Toyota specifically for a lifetime!

I am not sure that Ford has had anything to do with detrimentally impacting the quality of service at Volvo. I have noticed that you can have two Volvo stealerships, and their respective services will very like night and day. Nonetheless, I almost always am skeptical of stealerships. It is almost by definition that stealerships will endeavor to take your wallet to their proverbial laundry mat. However, lately I have noticed that in general the quality of Volvov service started to inch toward some form of improvement; it is still far from a BMW or Mercedes approach, however.

Ta-ta, j.

[Tom H]

I just posted in another thread that I recently traded my 2004 XC70 in for a 2008 Lexus RX350. The sole reason for trading was the utter incompetence of my local Volvo dealership. I'll spare the details but I wouldn't trust them to work on a pair of roller skates. I love the Volvo and think it is one of the most intelligently designed cars in existence. I searched heavily for a reliable independent to no avail. I didn't want to part with the XC but I have a serious health issue making vehicle reliability and dependability my top concerns. To be blunt, the Lexus IMO doesn't remotely compare to the Volvo in terms of features, functions and ride comfort. Fit and finish are identical. The Lexus doesn't have that solid Volvo feel and sense of safety that I've grown accustomed to. The factors that put me in the Lexus are that it is the most reliable car on the road today and it has an outstanding dealership and support reputation. I'm banking on it's longer term reliability to console myself that I gave up so many wonderful features in the XC70. If the reliability and an excellent dealer were in the picture for me I would sell the RX in a heartbeat and get another new XC70.

And I agree with others. The Japanese cars are high quality but have no soul what-so-ever. In the Volvo I felt like I was in the car and it was wrapping it's arms around me. In the RX I feel like I'm riding on a go cart and I'm completely disconnected. Zero soul!!

[PierreC]

Philosophicdreamer - I love the term "stealerships" that you coined - I think you should patent it!

Tom H - that is indeed sad, because I LOVE my XC. I must be fortunate, because all my Volvo's are exceptionally reliable to I only need "stealership" intervention during normal services and then I just pray that they don't mess anything up! I had only had one major problem with my XC, which [after the dealer replaced two fuel pumps was eventually traced to a faulty fuel pump relay] was eventually solved without any further damage. So I intend to keep my XC for as long as I can ...

[JRL]

Philosophicdreamer - I love the term "stealerships" that you coined - I think you should patent it!

Tom H - that is indeed sad, because I LOVE my XC. I must be fortunate, because all my Volvo's are exceptionally reliable to I only need "stealership" intervention during normal services and then I just pray that they don't mess anything up! I had only had one major problem with my XC, which [after the dealer replaced two fuel pumps was eventually traced to a faulty fuel pump relay] was eventually solved without any further damage. So I intend to keep my XC for as long as I can ...

Let's drop the "stealership" crap, they have a much larger overhead and the training costs to (usually) back it up
(and he did NOT coin the phrase, been around for 20 years or more)

[Lilja]

I discovered last month that the AWD was not working on my 2003 XC70 with 89,000 miles. My dealer had to open up my transmission and AWD unit to confirm this because my car did NOT show any trouble codes when hooked up to Volvo's computer analyzer. Apparently the trans and AWD unit each have a splined shaft thats spins. When the car's computer detects front wheels losing traction it locks the two splined shafts by sliding a collar over them which engages the AWD and powers the rear wheels. It seems the splines on my AWD unit were stripped clean off. They had to install a new AWD unit and collar at a cost of $2800.00! I asked why this happened and the dealer had no idea. So, based on that, I think that means I may have to replace this unit again sometime in the future. The tech who worked on my car said I was lucky because he had seen cars with the same problem where the sliding collar had gotten stuck inside the transmission requiring it to be replaced too.

Here's the kicker, I just made my last car payment about 2 weeks ago. All in all, this has been the most expensive to maintain car I have ever owned. Most of the front end suspension parts had to be replaced at around 60K miles. That cost another $1400.00. I bought this car because of all of the stories I had heard about Volvo cars and longevity. Stories of cars with 300,000 miles and more. I now see how you accomplish that. You just empty your wallet and fix everything as it breaks and you will make to 300,000 miles. It makes me think that I should have kept my old 1974 Ford Pinto. That car surely would have made it to a million miles if I had just had the good sense to keep repairing it.

Im sorry to say but this is complete rubbish. Volvo cars are extremely reliable specially if you compare them to the cars you compare them to.
What made your tranmission break I have no idea, maybe reckless driving from either you or the previous owner?
No cars are 100% bulletproof, all cars fail once or twice in their lifetime. What made your car break so much more is either extremely bad luck or someone isnt treating the car very well.

Weve had only volvo cars since the beginning of the 80s and we NEVER had any major problems. Never any expensive repairs. Theyve just kept running.

Dont pull down one of the worlds leading carmanufacters because of one car. I used one to that.

[Aviator]

Im sorry to say but this is complete rubbish. Volvo cars are extremely reliable specially if you compare them to the cars you compare them to.
What made your tranmission break I have no idea, maybe reckless driving from either you or the previous owner?
No cars are 100% bulletproof, all cars fail once or twice in their lifetime. What made your car break so much more is either extremely bad luck or someone isnt treating the car very well.

Weve had only volvo cars since the beginning of the 80s and we NEVER had any major problems. Never any expensive repairs. Theyve just kept running.

Dont pull down one of the worlds leading carmanufacters because of one car. I used one to that.

You're a man after my own heart........your words couldn't be more true !! As they say over here with regards to most things......garbage in = garbage out !! Treat the car with respect and it will be good to you......treat it like crap and it will treat you like crap !!

Dave.

[goldxc70]

garbage in = garbage out

The acronym GIGO for Garbage In, Garbage Out is an old computing term created when punch cards were used for data input. If a punch card was mispunched (garbage in), then the output print out was incorrect (garbage out). It was a play on FIFO for First In First Out.

No need to thank me for more useless information :D

[howardc64]

Personally, I think Volvo moving toward premium market in the last 10 year or so is the main cause of increasing maintenance cost.

Premium market results in a car with more complex features, higher price parts, and higher priced mechanics. The margins on Volvo parts + supplies are pretty outrageous when compared to none premium market cars. But they are totally inline with other premium brands.

Whenever I shop for P2 cars parts, I'm always amazed by the big price jump from P1 car's equivalent parts.

I think the other place Volvo probably could have done better (in any car segment) is

- Extend the early P2 transmission warranties. Honda did that when they had a bad batch of transmissions at about the same time frame (I had an 2000 Odyssey and Accord, both got the 100k mile transmission warranty). Cost Honda some money but it totally kept owner's loyalty and quality perception.

It seems Volvo also done a lot of "scaling" to increase the market share (introduce more models. Therefore engines and chassis. I can only imagine it has been hard for Volvo to keep up this level of scaling)

Sounds like we can thank Ford's acquisition of Volvo into its "Premium brand group" for the high cost? But then again, we did get a more "premium" car :)

[JRL]

Personally, I think Volvo moving toward premium market in the last 10 year or so is the main cause of increasing maintenance cost.

POSSIBLY

Premium market results in a car with more complex features, higher price parts, and higher priced mechanics. The margins on Volvo parts + supplies are pretty outrageous when compared to none premium market cars. But they are totally inline with other premium brands.

VOLVO IS NOT A PREMIUM CAR (YET). MID LUXURY FOR NOW

Whenever I shop for P2 cars parts, I'm always amazed by the big price jump from P1 car's equivalent parts.

THEY ALL SEEM TO BE ABOUT THE SAME AND I SERVICE MANY VOLVOS OF ALL YEARS

I think the other place Volvo probably could have done better (in any car segment) is

YEP

- Extend the early P2 transmission warranties. Honda did that when they had a bad batch of transmissions at about the same time frame (I had an 2000 Odyssey and Accord, both got the 100k mile transmission warranty). Cost Honda some money but it totally kept owner's loyalty and quality perception.

THEY LITERALLY WOULD GO BROKE, REPLACING 100,000 ODD TRANSMISSIONS

It seems Volvo also done a lot of "scaling" to increase the market share (introduce more models. Therefore engines and chassis. I can only imagine it has been hard for Volvo to keep up this level of scaling)

??

Sounds like we can thank Ford's acquisition of Volvo into its "Premium brand group" for the high cost? But then again, we did get a more "premium" car :)'

THE P2 CAR WAS 100% DESIGNED AND FINISHED BEFORE FORD BOUGHT VOLVO, (HOW MANY TIMES DOES THIS HAVE TO BE SAID)?
EVERY VOLVO THAT HAS BEEN DESIGNED SINCE THE ACQUISITION HAS MUCH BETTER RELIABILITY AND BUILD QUALITY..
S40,V50, NEW S80, C30, C70 ETC



**************************************************

[tapaugh]

Im sorry to say but this is complete rubbish. Volvo cars are extremely reliable specially if you compare them to the cars you compare them to.
What made your tranmission break I have no idea, maybe reckless driving from either you or the previous owner?
No cars are 100% bulletproof, all cars fail once or twice in their lifetime. What made your car break so much more is either extremely bad luck or someone isnt treating the car very well.

Weve had only volvo cars since the beginning of the 80s and we NEVER had any major problems. Never any expensive repairs. Theyve just kept running.

Dont pull down one of the worlds leading carmanufacters because of one car. I used one to that.

How dare you assume that my car failed because of mistreatment, abuse or lack of maintenance!! I bought this car new, it was meticulously maintained and cared for, it did not do ANY rough service mileage and was not driven by teenagers. I suppose blaming me for the car's mechanical failures will give some you people who still own Volvo's some false confidence in your machine. You know, it had to be the owner's fault, it couldn't have been the car.

Besides the transmission repair, I also had to replace tie rods at about 50K, and upper and lower ball joints. I'm a 55 year man, and have owned all kinds of cars and never had to replace front end parts so prematurely.

I sold this car around almost a year ago and have been driving my "souless" 2008 Rav4 ever since. So far, no problems of ANY kind with it. I truly wish I could have kept my XC70 as it was the most comfortable car to drive that I have ever owned. One thing I like now that it's gone..........my wallet has stopped "bleeding".

[Forkster]

Could we possibly not dig up old posts and treat them as new unless we have a legitimate question to carry forward? This post is almost one year old and we want to keep most of our current questions and comments on top. :rolleyes:

[g4hlr]

My condolences!

Even with Audi, at least you know their AWD system is up to snuff.

Truly, I am very sorry to hear about your AWD. Volvo simply did not know how to build an AWD car. Ours is still working at 120k mi. But, that is much luckier than average.

I'm surprised at that comment......Audi and Volvo both use the SAME Haldex drive!!! Perhaps you've got a better Audi main $tealer than I had. Loved my A6 but couldn't find a good service outlet. As for the XC70...yep, I've joined the ranks of the "front wheel drive only" club. FWIW, Volvo $tealers get caught out on this too. The one near me checks all XC trade-in's on their rolling road first! Say's a lot for the reliability......Volvo for life....well, as long as the wallet can stand it!

John

[g4hlr]

Questions for all -
1. Could the dealer impact our perception of our cars that we own?
2. What impact will the Company as a whole have?
3. For those who purchased their vehicles used, how are their views different? Are they holistic compared to new cars purchased (unbiased and based solely on the performance/reliability of the vehicle).
4. What impact does the previous owner have on reliability of a used car?[/QUOTE]

Hi, I must say I like Peter's comment that quality in service or product is what the client/customer gets out of it.

Regarding 3 & 4 above,

I bought a 2003 XC70 with one previous owner, 4 years old with 47K on the clock and full service history. The reason, it ticked all the boxes and I'd had a V70 before which I was very pleased with in terms of build quality. I compare this with the likes of Audi/VW, Toyota, Citroen, Puegeot, Renault, etc. all of which I have owned and in some cases taken to over 200,000 miles.

So WRT 3. above, I bought what I could afford and after research on forums such as this...(bloody good one!), which indicated don't buy a MY before 2003!

As for 4. The previous owner had a service carried out by an "independent". The impact? I now have AWD failure and Volvo don't want to know because I can't produce "evidence" that the independent garage correctly serviced the vehicle. The fact that I can produce positive evidence that the local main Volvo $tealer hasn't properly repaired my V70 in the past doesn't seem to interest them, (I wonder why?).

So....is my XC70 as good as say my A6....it's a different vehicle. If you asked about the V70, I'd say it was crap by comparison, poor turning circle...one of the worst I've ever experienced an one reason for trading the car.....poor internal storage, poor boot space, well, there are lots of niggles we could all comment on about our various cars. The XC70 as I said ticks the boxes at this point in time. As for the cost of ownership, well I guess I was just unlucky. However, I don't like the Volvo dealership attitude....and that's not confined to one dealer! When I tried to trade my V70 one dealer tried to rip me off by £4K!!! Said that since that had one service stamp by an "independent" it affected the price. Pointed out to me that if I bought from a Main $tealer the vehicle would've been thoroughly checked before sale. I pointed out to him that I had bought it from a Main $teaker only 5 months before and it had been checked and serviced and didn't need to be serviced again for another 9,000 miles, but I was greatful to him for showing me what berk/crook he was. (Mind you, I'd've been the berk if I'd done the deal!). So, impact of previous owner.....look at the service record if you want your Volvo warranty to remain valid. Yes I know all about European directives...like most EU directives, they're written on toilet paper....no make that rolls 'cos of the volume....'cos they're crap like any law that can't be reasonably enforced. It's too easy for the manufacturer to put the ownus on the client for proof of "correct" servicing, hence they get out of 99 times out of 10!

Happy motoring and may your visits to the $tealer be less apinful than mine!

[Motorhead]

It's an unfortunate fact of life that AWD gearboxes are generally not as reliable as two wheel drive ones due to the extra grip basically doubling the load on the box. The extra complexity doesn't help as parts often need to made smaller & less durable to be packaged in the same space.
I've spent most of my life around motorsport & have seen countless Subarus, Nissans, Mazdas & even Porsches lunch gearboxes from the shock load of hard launches.