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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Location
    Saskatoon
    Posts
    13

    Default '04 Transmission slip when cold and sitting for a few days

    I have an '04 XC70 with 253K kms on it, picked it up this past spring, and it needed a heap of little things done. Inner/out tie rods, front wheel bearing (driver), passenger CV (replaced whole axle), Front Struts (rear shocks are still on the list), rear diff didn't have any fluid, angle drive was replaced a couple of years ago (maybe 4 years). After reading through heaps of articles on here and Matthew's I have been able to troubleshoot and solve most of the issues. Car came with some service history (it was a lease, then purchased, serviced at both the dealer Van Herpt, and an independent shop until I got it from the in-laws). Anyhow, I digress.

    Current issue, is that after two transmission drain and fills (done on the last two oil changes) the transmission seems to slip a little after sitting for a week in the cooler temperatures we've been having in Toronto. Anyone else experience this? What gives? If I drive it every day, or even every couple of days, it seems fine on startup no slip (defined as higher than typical RPMs for a given speed). Usually it will resolve itself after a minute or so of being in drive. I have resorted to pulling out of the shed, and back in a couple of times before leaving. Usually long enough for the fluid to heat up, or whatever is going on.

    I have come across a few threads that seem to deal with slipping transmissions, but rather than revive a long dead thread, I decided to start anew.

    Toyota T-IV fluid, level seems good after warming up. Near the max line. My shed floor is on quite the angle, so if I check when cold it is at the hot line. Usually I'll go for a drive to a flat parking lot and then check the level. Or pull into the alley and leave it sit, then check.

    I have not installed a transmission filter, although I do have two inline magnefine filters on the floor next to my desk... They will get installed before the drive from T.O. to Saskatoon this summer/fall.

    I'm not too concerned, there are no other telltale signs that the transmission is on its way out (no hard shifts, or slipping at speed, etc.). More of a minor annoyance on those already cold days.

    Thanks!
    2004 XC70 - 253k

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,116

    Default

    Sounds like low fluid to me. I know what you said, but I would check it again, or perhaps just add 200ml.
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (126K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (55K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (143K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (235K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (295K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (225K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Location
    Saskatoon
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Thanks Astro14. I will check the fluid again, and perhaps add some more anyhow as you suggested.
    2004 XC70 - 253k

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Northshore - Great Lakes
    Posts
    813

    Default

    A recent simple & drain fill project drained close to 3.2L. Took a break for family time, and postponed the filling for next day -- put the plug back with old o'ring/seal.

    Next day, unscrewed the plugged to replace new o'ring, unexpected, it drained quite a bit. When added to the amount the day before and measured, it was close to 5 liters.

    Refilled slowly with Mobil ATF 3309 the amount that was drained, 5L, but did not do the gear shift sequence during each liter filled for reason beyond control -- radiator and trans cooler lines replaced and disconnected battery with no juice. Cold fluid registering OVERFILL on dipstick. Put the car back together and plugged the battery to charger. Now came the extreme cold weather.

    Battery strong, proceeded with the gear shift sequence patiently. Fluid still shows OVERFILL at the dipstick. Now it is polar vortex. I have heated garage so waited for weather to settle.

    At this point I'm asking myself "should I reset transmission adaptation", but I don't since it wasn't a gibson method OR flush.

    The weather was better by Friday. Started the car and move the gear from P to R with a BANG, which I've never experienced before. Dashboard spot for "R" is blank and car will not move.

    Went through the gear shift sequence few times and it started to reverse but slipped.

    The shift display these days is normal. It drives fine, but not always, DIM says "Transmission Service Required".
    Last edited by Xheart; 02-12-2019 at 12:09 PM.
    2001 V70XC +204k miles/ XeMODeX/ Pirelli 12/32"/ Duracell 48/ MOBIL-3309/ Pennzoil EURO 5W-40/ Great Lakes

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,116

    Default

    Wait - Xheart, was your first dipstick reading done with the engine OFF?? It's a meaningless reading. Truly.

    It sounds like your second reading was with the engine running, and I assume that by "gear shift sequence" you mean the following...the procedure is to shift the transmission to each gear and let it remain there for 3 seconds, if that's what you mean, then, OK, but it still may be a meaningless reading...because of temperature...

    For both of you guys:

    The "cold" marks on the bottom of the dipstick are valid if the fluid temperature is 20C. If you guys are measuring now, in this weather, you are WAY off.

    The "cold" level is only 4mm wide. Above or below is overfilled or underfilled.

    Better to check it warm. Drive for at least 30 minutes and use the warm marks. Idling. Dead level ground. Again, only a couple mm either side of the mark is acceptable. 200ml over/under and you've got the wrong level.

    The hot range is for 80C and in this weather, you may not get there. So, in this weather, you may have to interpolate.


    **Just because you put back the same amount as you drained, DOES NOT MEAN that your fluid level is correct. Unless you're measuring with a graduated cylinder, and account for every drop, you're probably NOT adding back what came out. Further, this method presumes that the level was correct to begin with, and that's not a safe assumption.
    Last edited by Astro14; 02-13-2019 at 06:14 AM.
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (126K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (55K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (143K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (235K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (295K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (225K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Northshore - Great Lakes
    Posts
    813

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Astro14 View Post
    Wait - Xheart, was your first dipstick reading done with the engine OFF?? It's a meaningless reading. Truly.

    It sounds like your second reading was with the engine running, and I assume that by "gear shift sequence" you mean the following...the procedure is to shift the transmission to each gear and let it remain there for 3 seconds, if that's what you mean, then, OK, but it still may be a meaningless reading...because of temperature...

    For both of you guys:

    The "cold" marks on the bottom of the dipstick are valid if the fluid temperature is 20C. If you guys are measuring now, in this weather, you are WAY off.

    The "cold" level is only 4mm wide. Above or below is overfilled or underfilled.

    Better to check it warm. Drive for at least 30 minutes and use the warm marks. Idling. Dead level ground. Again, only a couple mm either side of the mark is acceptable. 200ml over/under and you've got the wrong level.

    The hot range is for 80C and in this weather, you may not get there. So, in this weather, you may have to interpolate.


    **Just because you put back the same amount as you drained, DOES NOT MEAN that your fluid level is correct. Unless you're measuring with a graduated cylinder, and account for every drop, you're probably NOT adding back what came out. Further, this method presumes that the level was correct to begin with, and that's not a safe assumption.
    Yes, the 1st cold reading was engine OFF.
    Yes, the second fluid reading was cold too but engine idling. The "gear shift sequence" was 10 second at each position.
    Drove to a carwash after work to wash away - a 5 miles round trip. Few surges and hesitations along the way due to ECM for Accelerator Pedal Position Sensor - Low.

    Later, a check on fluid level showed OVERFILL on dipstick at room temperature engine OFF - 60ºF.

    Waiting for the replacement pedal before a drive to bring fluid to HOT can happen.
    2001 V70XC +204k miles/ XeMODeX/ Pirelli 12/32"/ Duracell 48/ MOBIL-3309/ Pennzoil EURO 5W-40/ Great Lakes

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Location
    Saskatoon
    Posts
    13

    Default

    Astro14, your intuition was correct. My issue was low fluid. Dumped in 200mls and is right as rain again. Thanks again.

    As an aside, now that I have been doing transmission fluid changes I have been wondering. What is harder on auto transmission, low fluid or over filled? Not that I plan on continuously doing either. Last drain and fill I went high, this one low. Next one will be closer first time. Probably.
    2004 XC70 - 253k

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Northshore - Great Lakes
    Posts
    813

    Default

    Drove it for a while in 25-40 mph zone Saturday. It was shifting normally, manual worked fine too. ATF fluid temp over VIDA read 80ºC (176ºF) while coolant 83ºC (181ºF) at idle. The fluid at dipstick shows max at HOT markers.

    Take away: Even with unusual ATF drained amount of 5 liters in SIMPLE D&F procedure, transmission will adapt without fluid counter reset. Complete SIMPLE D&F procedure and drive for adaptation. Idle and check fluid level when transmission is hot with ATF fluid at 80ºC.

    ASTRO: would ATF fluid maintain its temp level of 80ºC if trans cooler is working?
    Last edited by Xheart; 02-25-2019 at 08:05 AM.
    2001 V70XC +204k miles/ XeMODeX/ Pirelli 12/32"/ Duracell 48/ MOBIL-3309/ Pennzoil EURO 5W-40/ Great Lakes

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    Grand Rapids, MI
    Posts
    81

    Default

    I'm curious what the condition of the old tranny oil was. Was it pretty dark? Hasn't happened to me but I have read that replacing dirty tranny oil can cause issues because tranny was relying on the "dirt" to function properly. Just a possibility.
    IF IT AIN'T BROKE - DON'T FIX IT!
    04 Volvo XC70 5LT 143k "Floatey" Ruby Red, Valvoline 0W40
    07 Honda Accord V6 120k Silver, Napa 5W20 Blend
    07 Honda Accord L4 130k Bronze, Napa 5W20 Blend

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Virginia Beach
    Posts
    4,116

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Voldog View Post
    I'm curious what the condition of the old tranny oil was. Was it pretty dark? Hasn't happened to me but I have read that replacing dirty tranny oil can cause issues because tranny was relying on the "dirt" to function properly. Just a possibility.
    I’ve read that, too.

    Of course, I’ve also read that the Earth was flat...

    So...
    Current Fleet:
    2016 Tundra Crewmax 4WD 1794
    2005 MB S600 (126K, Michelin AS4, HPL 0W40)
    2005 MB SL600 (55K Michelin AS4, Mobil 1 0W40)
    2004 V70R (143K, six speed M66, HPL 5W40)
    2004 XC90 (235K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-XC (295K, HPL 0W30 Euro)
    2002 V70-T5 (225K, IPD bars, Bilsteins)
    2001 V70-T5 (125K, IPD downpipe, cat back and other mods)
    1932 Packard Sedan (straight 8, dual sidemounts, original paint and interior, Shell Rotella 15W40)

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