Ball Joints -- the Other Wheel

[Barinthus]

As you may recall, we had quite a discussion about the failed balljoint on my 2007 XC70 (wheel detaching at 40 mph). Much of the commentary was quite helpful, even if a few remarks were less than pleasant. I certainly appreciated all the comments.

Unfortunately, our moderator, Forkster, closed that thread. There are close to 5,000 views there. Wow, 5,000 views over a ball joint. I had some back and forth PMs with Forkster and we both learned a little more about each other. He is a terrific guy, even if his notion of the First Amendment is not the same as mine! But like Mayor Bloomberg with Occupy Wall Street, at some point good order must re-appear from the chaos.

In any event, after I got my car back (and after I found some time), I took the car to my mechnic to check the other front wheel. Sure enough, he found some play in the wheel (it moved about an inch back any forth).

As a precaution, we replaced some parts. Specifically, we replaced the ball joint and a metal arm -- i believe it is called was an upper tie rod (it was loose too) and the ball joint had some play in it too, but was fully intact.

I took some comparative picture, which I share below (n.b.: the rubber hood was fully in tact, but i cut it away to take the pictures). The two ball joints below are the exact same age (5 years old) and were on the same car, and subject to the same conditions. Yet there is quite a difference, and yes, quite a bit of corrosion on the one that failed.

Let me know what you think (and please, please no more comments about 1. noises I should have heard (there were no noises) and 2. how my mechanics failed me (he didn't!))

ps. How can I remove the ball from the socket? Do you need some special tools?

[Barinthus]

a few more pictures

[Barinthus]

link to last thread --- http://www.volvoxc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19707

[billr99]

So, I take it that you see now what we all were trying to tell you. The ball joint that you dissected is what I would call more "normal". That is, the boot was intact, perserving the grease. Just because of that, that does not mean that the joint is immune from normal wear which apparently you and your mechanic detected and thus your efforts to change it out. But the shiny surface condition of the ball and the uncorroded portion of the socket which was covered by the boot is what would normally be expected.

The joint that failed obviously has severe pitting with severe wear of the socket. Without seeing the corresponding boot in its form as it was when the joint failed, we can only speculate as to the cause of the pitting and severe wear. My many years of experience tell me that it's likely cause was a torn or dislodged boot as evidenced by the rust and pits, but that is not the only possibility. I suppose it is possible that the ball was defective in not having a sufficient amount of hardening but that would not explain the rust. That is only explained by a torn or loose boot.

I will let other speculate on the abilities of your mechanic at this point, as well as your ability to detect noises and such. Without driving the car in that condition, one cannot tell exactly. We can only say that in a normal situation which some of us have seen a few times, those cases exhibit characteristics that would have enabled detection of the problem prior to failure. That is just the way it is. As you say, in your case this was not evident so we take it as you have stated it. As it is, you have now sorted both joints and the car is back to the way it should be.

As far as separating a mildly-worn ball joint, I cannot offer a suggestion. They are pressed together in a multi-tonne press. Without having access to a similar bit of kit, you probably couldn't separate them with bashing them which wouldn't really get them apart for a decent examination.

Cheers,

Bill

[Barinthus]

I will let other speculate on the abilities of your mechanic at this point, as well as your ability to detect noises and such. Without driving the car in that condition, one cannot tell exactly. We can only say that in a normal situation which some of us have seen a few times, those cases exhibit characteristics that would have enabled detection of the problem prior to failure. That is just the way it is.

Thanks for the comment.

As for the above quote, I knew you could not resist!

[billr99]

Thanks for the comment.

As for the above quote, I knew you could not resist!

Oh well, what can I say?

Cheers,

Bill

[Astro14]

There is a dramatic contrast in the condition of the two joints...the wear, the rust, heavy pitting, and distorted ball in the first are all missing from this most recent replacement...and this recent one was worn out...

The outer tie rod end is a commonly replaced part...on all cars, but esp. on these...and I am glad your guy did replace it...

The more rough the roads on which the car is operated, the faster these components wear out...metro Boston is no picnic...not Southern CA...so, I am not at all surprised that there are worn components...

But the dramatic difference between the two joints illustrates just how far gone that left joint was...no wonder it failed...worst I have ever seen is one like the right side that was just replaced...

I am glad that you posted the new pics...what a contrast!

[granlund]

... Without seeing the corresponding boot in its form as it was when the joint failed, we can only speculate as to the cause of the pitting and severe wear. My many years of experience tell me that it's likely cause was a torn or dislodged boot as evidenced by the rust and pits, but that is not the only possibility. I suppose it is possible that the ball was defective in not having a sufficient amount of hardening but that would not explain the rust. That is only explained by a torn or loose boot.
...

Another possibility, if the boot was never torn, is that the ball joint was never greased from the manufacturer.

[cattlecar]

The dissection of the failed ball joint showed it had grease. It was in the long thread.
No grease would have been a galled ball and the failed joint had a pitted ball that occurs from rust.